Curse

D8tura · Jul 03, 2007, 06:55 PM // 18:55

Ok kids to get each rank you must contribute 5k this many times (amounts are from rank to the next rank)

rank 1 / 10 times

rank 2 / 15 more times

rank 3 / 15 more times

rank 4 / 15 more times

rank 5 / 32.5 more times

rank 6 / 32.5 more times

rank 7 / 65 more times

rank 8 / 65 more times

rank 9 / 125 more times

rank 10 / 125 more times

rank 11 / 250 more times

rank 12 / 250 more times

Grand total of 1000 times you must contribute 5k faction

the double for alliance faction is figured into the amounts you must contribute from rank to rank

if you didn't get double faction to your title you would have to double these numbers

however long it takes you to farm 5k take that time and multiply to a thousand

darktyco · Jul 03, 2007, 07:03 PM // 19:03

Holy crap, when I calculated how long it takes me to get 5k faction (doing about 5 Kuzick Arborstone HM farm runs) and then multiplied by 1000 I almost passed out.

TabascoSauce · Jul 03, 2007, 07:09 PM // 19:09

I am the same as darktyco - Holy Crap.

Awesome way to illustrate the problem!

Thanks!
TabascoSauce

D8tura · Jul 03, 2007, 07:14 PM // 19:14

oh to further clarify, there are 8760 hours in a year

lets say eack 5k takes 1 hour = 1000 hours

let's say 45 min = 750 hours

30 min = 500 hours

get's better and better doesn't it?

TabascoSauce · Jul 03, 2007, 07:23 PM // 19:23

Hey, that is only 500 days @ 2 hours a day!

(whoops, GW2 may be out by then?)

Thanks!
TabascoSauce

bart · Jul 04, 2007, 01:13 AM // 01:13

and who was it who said that the solution for stopping ppl from leeching is to half the faction given for winning? lol

Omniclasm · Jul 04, 2007, 01:20 AM // 01:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by bart

and who was it who said that the solution for stopping ppl from leeching is to half the faction given for winning? lol

Your sarcasm detector appears to be malfunctioning.

Perfected Shadow · Jul 04, 2007, 10:42 AM // 10:42

Quote:

It was a neck to neck battle.

Luxon was leading, then Kurzick, then luxon, then kurzick won.

We lost by less than 7 points.

Now....why the go red do we get a lousy amount of faction points when the points were SOO evenly match?

And this is an IDEAL situation. No leechers. Everyone fighting. Everyone capping.

And the reward still sucks.

This is the situation I've been in several times that's really frustrating.

Please revert the faction reduction for the losing team.

william1975 · Jul 04, 2007, 11:36 AM // 11:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by D8tura

however long it takes you to farm 5k take that time and multiply to a thousand

Wow this is a cool post, I actually thought it would take far too long to get to 10 mil

I think it may take me 42 days of constant play to get 10 mil

While i'm in no way goign to do that, I at least now know Its not as difficult as I first thought it would be to do this. 5K faction doesnt take that long to get, an hour at most if you do thing intensly.

You only need to kill 500 normal foes in HM and those lovely bosses give you 250 for a kill

Shendaar · Jul 04, 2007, 01:16 PM // 13:16

Imo, the reward should be fairly high even when you lost the match so it doesn't feel like you wasted your time.

However, what I think is needed is a faction bonus to the winning alliance. The problem with AB is that because of the unbalanced maps, the winning side is usually easily outnumbered by the losing one(because they have more chance to win). What happens then is that the losing side gets stuck on the "no opposing party" timer because no one is interest in playing on the other side. The recent update only made this worst because now, your reward for losing is even lower.

If a factions bonus was given to the winning alliance, this could just create a good enough incentive for more players on the winning side to risk it.

This has been and still is the major problem with AB. Whenever your alliance is losing, you can't get in because the kurzick vs luxon ratio gets all screwed up. Whatever can be done to get more people to play on the winning side would make AB more enjoyable as a whole.

Frantic-Sheep · Jul 04, 2007, 02:54 PM // 14:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by Series

This isn't an "unlock", it isn't a vanity like 15k armor, it is a skill you use to play the game.

But the skill isn´t necessary to PLAY the game or to advance in the game. You can completely enjoy and finish the game without it. All titles are a bonus, or vanity. It´s the same as having level 8 lightbringer. That sure helps you, but its far from necessary to advance inside the GW world.

For as far as I know the skills dont make you significant better and thus giving you an advantage in the game for lets say a rank 1 and rank 10 <insert rank name>. It's not that you earn 10x as much money with 1 skill at level 10, comparing to one with level 1 (for example). In no way it outbalances the game - or proof me wrong.

If the difference is too great - I assume they should indeed lower the max cap as some suggested.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Master Ketsu

Cheating by definition to a game designer = Doing anything in a game in order to bypass what was originally intended by the designer.

So /roll is technically cheating.

Not really imo. Players will always try to break your game (if it makes them stronger, advance quicker, or simply enlarge epeen). If you can do anything to bypass it and succeed, its called a flaw in your design. Simple example from a book I read somewhere. If you had a rubber tire hanging on a rope, and you can punch it, and then dodge it, and call it a game. You play it a few times and actually becoming good at punch-dodging the construction. You let your friend play it and tell him to dodge the tire as much as he can. He just doesnt punch it and says: TADA! Did he cheat the system? Yes he did, but is it his fault? No, you didnt gave him motivation to actually punch the bag, or enforce the rule.

Rolling was a problem in HvH when it was released. It got 'fixed' when they introduced ladder play, so people got penalties when they left (losing points). However I'm wondering if it hasn't come back by now within ranks 5000-10000 (the level where people dont care about the ranks, but still want their title).

A problem I see with the reward system is not that its the rewards an sich.. They had it balanced out quite a bit, until they upped the rewards for active players/winners. Problem is: you cant do much about it for a great deal (2/3rds actually). Let me explain it. You get into the system and only fill out and have control at 1/3rd of the total team. If you rock the game with your group, and the other 2/3rd either leaves, are utterly crap or whatever, you're most likely to lose anyway.
The same for the Wintersday example people gave above here. You had no total control over the outcome.
Now lets take 2 other examples. A PvP one, HA: You have total control over the party, there is hardly any losing award too, but its in your total power to win (arguable but its not the point). A PvE one, sunspear titles, its a grind, but you can influence the outcome to the max, all in your hands.

A test would be, would you still be angry if you where allowed a 12v12 team - lets say an alliance team brought in the game? (I mean, winner wins more than before, and double the points for donating!).

Sorry for the long post - hope the points came across and made sense. If not sorry for wasting a few minutes of your life ;p

Raven Nebula · Jul 04, 2007, 04:39 PM // 16:39

I see the problem as frustrating as well, though i understand A-Net is trying to get more people into AB and make it more competitive. However, all that's happened is people only playing when they know they have a greater then 50% chance at winning. Why waste 20 minutes playinf to win not much faction. I mean, I love AB as much as the next person, but it's made it so that you have 400 luxons waiting to fight 30 kurzicks and vice versa. And if you ever do go in, your entire team leaves.

So, how do you get more people to play while still making it fair to everybody and eliminate leeching?

A) Buff the Kill Points up a bit. 1 point a kill is umm...pointless. Not trying to be mean, but it's just kinda silly. Maybe 5 points a kill?

B) This one wouldn't be very popular...but there is a point to it. Have a point penalty for dying. Not big, maybe 1 or 2 points. The reason for this is...

C) Make the spawning area in the base a health degen area once the match starts. So you leech, your health goes down and you die. This way every time a leecher dies he loses faction from his possible total for that match. Forces leechers to at least leave the the base and then there is the possibilty that they are killed by somebody else, giving that person faction and taking away from the leechers total yet again. Make sense?

D) Just like you get points for a kill, give points for every shrine that you help cap. This will encourage capping and not just running around attacking people, though if you enjoy running around killing you can still do that (see the increased points per kill). I would say more points for capping a shrine then for a kill. Capping makes the game more fun in my opinion.

E) Decrease the points gained by winning.

I think if you do those things leechers can only gain the amount of points won by the team as a whole minus the amount deducted for their deaths. Leechers will no longer be able to gain the amount of faction that they've been getting by just sitting there.

Games will be competitive, but not unfair to the loser. If your team loses 500-490, you'll get the 490 points, points for every shrine you've capped and for every kill you've made, with a slight penalty for deaths. The gain for kills outweighs the deaths so that if you actually participate your deaths won't greatly hurt you.

And of course we want to reward the winning team, but not so much that the leechers get a ton.

Here's the math of how I see it.

Let's say during the match you help cap say 8 shrines. And let's also say that you get 15 points per shrine cap. (8x15=120) Say you kill 12 people (5 pts a kill X 12 = 60 points ). And that you died 8 times (-2 x 8 = -16 pts). Your team was in a close match but lost 500-473. So you get...

Points For Capping Shrines = 120
Points For Kills = 60
Penalty For Dying = -16
Team Capping Points = 473
Total = 637

That's pretty reasonable in my opinion.
If you have similar numbers but won you get another say 750 faction.

I dunno...maybe I've thought about this too much lol. Thanks for reading.

Series · Jul 04, 2007, 05:28 PM // 17:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by D8tura

oh to further clarify, there are 8760 hours in a year

lets say eack 5k takes 1 hour = 1000 hours

let's say 45 min = 750 hours

30 min = 500 hours

get's better and better doesn't it?

So if I spent 11.4% of my year farming for faction, I will have the max title.

...That seems worth it!

D8tura · Jul 04, 2007, 06:37 PM // 18:37

After playing with SHITTY groups all afternoon and it's the map favoured for us, I support leavers - AB is bullshit now